moose
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Post by moose on Mar 7, 2014 17:23:52 GMT -5
A reader informed me that the Commissioners were consolidating the County's Veterans Affairs Office with the Human Resources Department. It seems that the county had two full-time employees (Ms. Tammy DeGroft, Veterans Service Officer and Mr. John Farrell, Veterans Affairs Director). They cut Ms. DeGroft's hours and made her part-time (losing her benefits) which would have left no one in the office to meet with any veterans that might show up in Mr. Farrell's absence (due to meetings and/or appointments). The Commissioners answer to that was to move the Veterans Affairs Department into the Human Resource Department, so that IF anyone showed up, they would at least see a face, and they could take a message to pass along to Mr. Farrell at a later date. Neither Ms. DeGroft NOR Mr. Farrell appreciated the lack of respect and the apparent low priority the Commissioners place on our veterens, so they both submitted their resignations effective March 14, 2014. Now there is NO ONE to service the needs of our veterans in the county and they must travel to Franklin or York County to have their needs met. Apparently it was no secret that Adams County's Veterans are held in such low regard. The Adams County Manager, Albert Penksa, was allegedly quoted as saying, "the Veterans are a LOW PRIORITY." Commissioner Randy Phiel reiterated his distaste for veterans by allegedly adding, "I'm not worried because I have Veterans I go to the VFW with and I am not hearing any complaints from any of the veterans, so obviously it's not a problem". So, if he can drink beer with them, it dulls their senses and makes everything alright...? Sure, this is just one side of the story, but if I were to call and request the County's side of the story, you can imagine how I'd be welcomed. So, take it for what it's worth, but I have no reason to doubt my source. There are also rumors that of that $10 million dollar line of credit the Commissioners recently took out, that it's all gone and now they have to figure out how to repay it. I'd ask about it in one of their meetings, but they won't give anybody any answers, Especially Me! Read about the consolidation and then scroll down to see the release of Mr. Farrell and Ms. DeGroft from their duties HERE
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 7, 2014 18:51:24 GMT -5
Sorry moose, maybe it wasn't meant the way it came out but I find that statement insulting to veterans everywhere.
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moose
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Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Mar 7, 2014 18:55:22 GMT -5
Sorry moose, maybe it wasn't meant the way it came out but I find that statement insulting to veterans everywhere. What statement? I am a veteran and I surely don't disrespect them.
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 7, 2014 18:57:44 GMT -5
Commissioner Randy Phiel reiterated his distaste for veterans by allegedly adding, "I'm not worried because I have Veterans I go to the VFW with and I am not hearing any complaints from any of the veterans, so obviously it's not a problem". So, if he can drink beer with them, it dulls their senses and makes everything alright...? Sorry moose, maybe it wasn't meant to come out the way it did, but I find that statement insulting to veterans everywhere.
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 7, 2014 18:59:28 GMT -5
Sorry moose, maybe it wasn't meant the way it came out but I find that statement insulting to veterans everywhere. What statement? I am a veteran and I surely don't disrespect them. Sorry, kept trying to fix it and I couldn't and had to start over.
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moose
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Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Mar 7, 2014 19:10:54 GMT -5
Commissioner Randy Phiel reiterated his distaste for veterans by allegedly adding, "I'm not worried because I have Veterans I go to the VFW with and I am not hearing any complaints from any of the veterans, so obviously it's not a problem". So, if he can drink beer with them, it dulls their senses and makes everything alright...? Sorry moose, maybe it wasn't meant to come out the way it did, but I find that statement insulting to veterans everywhere. The first part was an alleged "quote" supplied by my source. The beer part...don't know how that disrespects veterans? I'm a veteran AND I drink beer (once in awhile) and when I do, politics is usually the last thing on my mind. If I needed the services that is typically offered veterans by a Department such as the one the County used to have, I'd be darn glad they were there. Thankfully, I haven't had a need to research the opportunities they provided. There are however, less fortunate folks than I and some of those do need those services. It perturbs me that our veterans are thought so poorly of...they might fair better in Adams County if they were cows. (there's a statement that might ruffle some feathers)
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 7, 2014 19:32:28 GMT -5
Sorry moose, maybe it wasn't meant to come out the way it did, but I find that statement insulting to veterans everywhere. The first part was an alleged "quote" supplied by my source. The beer part...don't know how that disrespects veterans? I'm a veteran AND I drink beer (once in awhile) and when I do, politics is usually the last thing on my mind. If I needed the services that is typically offered veterans by a Department such as the one the County used to have, I'd be darn glad they were there. Thankfully, I haven't had a need to research the opportunities they provided. There are however, less fortunate folks than I and some of those do need those services. It perturbs me that our veterans are thought so poorly of...they might fair better in Adams County if they were cows. (there's a statement that might ruffle some feathers) No, moose, not the beer part, the part that suggests that having a couple of beers dulls their senses and they are incapable of having a rational discussion. And you don't think political discussions happen in bars? ? Really? ? To be honest, I think it's important to hear both sides of this story. Your side sounds more like sour grapes, at least the way that you present it.
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moose
Post Master
Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Mar 7, 2014 19:40:35 GMT -5
It could very well be sour grapes, but good luck trying to get the other side of the story. You can't get answers from them even at their meetings. Beer dulls EVERYONE'S senses, not just veterans. Never said they were incapable of having a rational discussion. To have the entire (two people) department hand in their resignations at the exact same time suggests something ain't kosher in there regarding the handling of the Veterans affairs. If you can get that other side of the story, please enlighten us, otherwise we only have what we have, to go on.
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Post by Alex Oreilly on Mar 8, 2014 1:58:10 GMT -5
How many Veterans in Adams County use the services the department offers? Maybe it is used very little and not a big demand for it so they don't need two full time people. This is not the first time that these current Commissioners have consolidated Departments and consolidating departments is not necessarily a bad thing.
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moose
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Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Mar 8, 2014 13:24:46 GMT -5
Can someone post the article in the Times today about the Veterans Affairs Department? I haven't read it yet. Thanks!
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Post by Fire Marshal Bill on Mar 8, 2014 16:34:40 GMT -5
According to the article, the initial relocation of the Veterans Affairs office sounds like a good idea. To have a full time receptionist to at least get a name and contact number for the veteran in need, so someone with an understanding of the policies and procedures can contact the veteran and help them.
My question is why were Ms. DeGroft’s hours cut? Was nobody visiting the office? Was there no work for her?
If this consolidation resulted in the resignation of possibly the only two people in the county government who know how to address veterans issues, who is handling them now. Does someone in the HR office have the understanding to help veterans with their issues?
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 8, 2014 17:36:21 GMT -5
Can someone post the article in the Times today about the Veterans Affairs Department? I haven't read it yet. Thanks! Here you go moose!
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 8, 2014 18:11:02 GMT -5
According to the article, the initial relocation of the Veterans Affairs office sounds like a good idea. To have a full time receptionist to at least get a name and contact number for the veteran in need, so someone with an understanding of the policies and procedures can contact the veteran and help them. My question is why were Ms. DeGroft’s hours cut? Was nobody visiting the office? Was there no work for her? If this consolidation resulted in the resignation of possibly the only two people in the county government who know how to address veterans issues, who is handling them now. Does someone in the HR office have the understanding to help veterans with their issues? The director position, according to the article, will be posted within the week. There is no mention, at least in the article, about posting for the assistant position. Until a new director is hired and on board my guess would be that the human resources department will be the contact point, and they will be referred to offices in another county for assistance until the new director has been hired, or it may mean that there have been staff in the human resources department that have been cross trained to assist in handling veteran's affairs, just my guess. I doubt that this consolidation was made without any plan for the "what if".
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moose
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Post by moose on Mar 8, 2014 19:49:45 GMT -5
Thanks Lifesaver! Interesting article and clearly spun to make the county leaders look good. My source tells me that it's not quite accurate. From a purely technical perspective, Mr. Farrell may have 'technically' retired. However, usually a retiree walks out with his/her head held high after many years of loyal service. Mr. Farrell, unfortunately, was escorted from the Courthouse on Friday while Security waited idly by while he packed his personal belongings. Sources say he will be paid for his last week and his leaving in this fashion will NOT be held against him in any way. In the interim, Ms. DeGroft presumably will be available to handle the Veterans needs, although as I understand the situation, she is part-time and her last day will be Friday the 14th. Until they hire someone capable enough to handle the affairs of the veterans, they will be handled by the Human Resources Department, who knows nothing of Veteran Affairs and/or Programs. Commissioner Phiel remains confident that the restructuring of the Veterans Affairs Office will result in better service to the county's veterans. In my opinion, this will only result in better service to the veterans IF, the new hire(s) are themselves accredited, upon being hired. The out-going personnel were BOTH, Nationally Accredited, which means that they both were knowledgeable and proficient in the State and National standards for handling Veterans' Affairs. There are many programs and entitlements that veterans are eligible for and a Veterans' Service Officer MUST be accredited to be qualified to submit the paperwork on behalf of the veterans, to some of the Programs. Until the county has an 'accredited' Service Officer, those veterans will NOT be served as well as they should be. A new hire that is NOT 'accredited', has one year from the date of employment to attain that distinction. Which brings me to my NEXT task...to look into my crystal ball and try to predict who will be the NEXT Veterans Affairs Director. Hmmm, who could it be??? It's becoming clearer now....someone close to the Courthouse.........someone with ties to one or more of the Commissioners.......how about someone close to the Chairman of the Commissioners (Randy Phiel)....does anyone else see it yet??? My guess is the NEXT Adams County Veterans Affairs Director will be.....(drumroll please),.....Stan Clark! You remember Stan, don't you? He's Randy Phiel's best bud (BFF) and he filled in for Randy at one of the Candidate Forums, in Randy's absence, and said a whole bunch of nice things about Randy. He's a regular fixture at the Courthouse, and his wife (reportedly) just happens to work in the Human Resources Department. It's all becoming clearer now. Randy owes Stan! This would be a good pay-back for all the good things he's done for Randy. A decent salary, good benefits, and a chance to work with his BFF. This is how politics works on the grander scale, right? Assuming this really happens...Commissioner Phiel has learned the political gamesmanship and all that comes with it, rather quickly. By the way, Stan Clark, he himself a veteran, is not yet accredited. He COULD become so...he'll have one year to do so, if hired. Expect an article about this topic in the Evening Sun next week sometime. I'm expecting the Sun to be a little less biased and possibly get "the other side" of the story. I doubt they'll predict the next Director, though.
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 9, 2014 17:24:42 GMT -5
All speculation aside, isn't the bottom line whether veterans will receive the help that they need when they call the veteran's affairs office? I'm sure the former director sometimes got sick or went on vacation. I'm sure that if someone called the office they just didn't say "you'll have to wait until so and so gets back, we can't help you." I'm sure that if someone needs help during the transition period until a new director can get up and running that calls will be referred to other offices for assistance. When a patient asks me a question and I don't know the answer I don't just say "Sorry, don't know." I say, "I don't know, but I will find out or find someone that does." So, as long as veterans that seek assistance from this office are satisfied that they are being helped, does it really matter which office or person that help comes from? If veterans don't feel they are being helped than that is a whole different story.
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moose
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Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Mar 9, 2014 19:58:16 GMT -5
All speculation aside, isn't the bottom line whether veterans will receive the help that they need when they call the veteran's affairs office? I'm sure the former director sometimes got sick or went on vacation. I'm sure that if someone called the office they just didn't say "you'll have to wait until so and so gets back, we can't help you." I'm sure that if someone needs help during the transition period until a new director can get up and running that calls will be referred to other offices for assistance. When a patient asks me a question and I don't know the answer I don't just say "Sorry, don't know." I say, "I don't know, but I will find out or find someone that does." So, as long as veterans that seek assistance from this office are satisfied that they are being helped, does it really matter which office or person that help comes from? If veterans don't feel they are being helped than that is a whole different story. For putting all speculation aside, it sure seems like you speculated about a lot of things happening! The Director did indeed have times when he was out of the office. That was when Ms. DeGroft filled in. So, going forward...if they hire ONLY an accredited Director, they will be shy an accredited fill-in. If they hire ONLY non-accredited Director, they will be shy two accredited Officers (compared to before). If they hire an accredited Director and a non-accredited fill-in, they will still be shy an accredited fill-in. All of those scenarios leave the county veterans to be served in a lesser fashion than before. The only comparable solution is to hire two accredited Officers, one Director and one fill-in, that both can hit the ground running. Beyond that, the veterans are not going to be served as well as before, no matter what Phiel claims will happen.
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 9, 2014 21:23:33 GMT -5
All speculation aside, isn't the bottom line whether veterans will receive the help that they need when they call the veteran's affairs office? I'm sure the former director sometimes got sick or went on vacation. I'm sure that if someone called the office they just didn't say "you'll have to wait until so and so gets back, we can't help you." I'm sure that if someone needs help during the transition period until a new director can get up and running that calls will be referred to other offices for assistance. When a patient asks me a question and I don't know the answer I don't just say "Sorry, don't know." I say, "I don't know, but I will find out or find someone that does." So, as long as veterans that seek assistance from this office are satisfied that they are being helped, does it really matter which office or person that help comes from? If veterans don't feel they are being helped than that is a whole different story. For putting all speculation aside, it sure seems like you speculated about a lot of things happening! The Director did indeed have times when he was out of the office. That was when Ms. DeGroft filled in. So, going forward...if they hire ONLY an accredited Director, they will be shy an accredited fill-in. If they hire ONLY non-accredited Director, they will be shy two accredited Officers (compared to before). If they hire an accredited Director and a non-accredited fill-in, they will still be shy an accredited fill-in. All of those scenarios leave the county veterans to be served in a lesser fashion than before. The only comparable solution is to hire two accredited Officers, one Director and one fill-in, that both can hit the ground running. Beyond that, the veterans are not going to be served as well as before, no matter what Phiel claims will happen. As long as they are given direction to someone who can help them why wouldn't they?
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Post by Spin Doctor on Mar 10, 2014 11:16:57 GMT -5
Expect an article about this topic in the Evening Sun next week sometime. I'm expecting the Sun to be a little less biased and possibly get "the other side" of the story. I doubt they'll predict the next Director, though. An unbiased article by the Hanover Sun? That would be a first. Are you aware that they just fired their editor, and they only print 3 days a week? It seems like everytime you post here, you're always insinuating wrongdoing or a coverup at the Courthouse.
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moose
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Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Mar 10, 2014 12:11:59 GMT -5
Expect an article about this topic in the Evening Sun next week sometime. I'm expecting the Sun to be a little less biased and possibly get "the other side" of the story. I doubt they'll predict the next Director, though. An unbiased article by the Hanover Sun? That would be a first. Are you aware that they just fired their editor, and they only print 3 days a week? It seems like everytime you post here, you're always insinuating wrongdoing or a coverup at the Courthouse. I know for a fact that the Sun is preparing a story on the Veterans Office. I also know that they plan to interview either one or both of the two soon to be former employees who handed in their resignations. The Times never reached out to those two. Already the the Sun is less biased. Two resignations effective the same day, in the same County Department, with one being escorted from the Courthouse, does NOT equal a Retirement! Please acquaint yourself with the Clean & Green Law and when you're ready, meet me at the Courthouse. I show you around the terminals and give you a birds eye view of what's really happening in the county. When you spend the time I've spent and uncovered what I've uncovered, you'd be skeptical too. I'm confident enough in my view that I've litigated against them to make it right. When our county leadership is willing to penalize 40,000 property owners for the sake of a few, you're godd@mn right I'm skeptical!
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 10, 2014 20:00:42 GMT -5
Expect an article about this topic in the Evening Sun next week sometime. I'm expecting the Sun to be a little less biased and possibly get "the other side" of the story. I doubt they'll predict the next Director, though. An unbiased article by the Hanover Sun? That would be a first. Are you aware that they just fired their editor, and they only print 3 days a week? It seems like everytime you post here, you're always insinuating wrongdoing or a coverup at the Courthouse. I sometimes feel that when I read an article in the Hanover Sun that I expect to see National Enquirer blasted across the front page heading. Is the goal to be unbiased or sensational? Sometimes I'm not sure.
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Post by Spin Doctor on Mar 11, 2014 11:54:13 GMT -5
Apparently it was no secret that Adams County's Veterans are held in such low regard. The Adams County Manager, Albert Penksa, was allegedly quoted as saying, "the Veterans are a LOW PRIORITY." Commissioner Randy Phiel reiterated his distaste for veterans by allegedly adding, "I'm not worried because I have Veterans I go to the VFW with and I am not hearing any complaints from any of the veterans, so obviously it's not a problem". So, if he can drink beer with them, it dulls their senses and makes everything alright...? "Allegedly quoted" - you mean, hearsay. Got it.
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moose
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Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Mar 11, 2014 21:20:21 GMT -5
"Allegedly quoted" - you mean, hearsay. Got it. Yeah, I chose my words carefully. Bottom line is my source has yet to be disproven and I have no reason yet, to doubt their claims. On the other hand, I can prove certain officials have broken the law on multiple occasions, drew up a New Clean & Green policy that was supposed to make things right but in reality was an attempt to tweak the law to make their actions lawful (note they have no authority to alter statutory nor common law), and all of their misdeeds have shifted tax burden from one group of folks to another. So, until my source(s) has been discredited or someone proves my allegations false, I shall continue preaching from my soapbox. Unless you're from the the minority that benefits from the county's C&G practices, you should welcome my viewpoint and persistence. If you're on the other side of the tracks, I seek to make you pay your lawful share of the tax burden.
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HoneyBadger
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HoneyBadger don't give a shit.
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Post by HoneyBadger on Mar 12, 2014 15:59:46 GMT -5
Congratulations, moose, you are the "new" formertownie in the new BV forum. Happy for you.
Have the Commissioners indicated how they will educate veterans and their families to the fact that Veterans Affairs no longer exists and they must call Human Resources for assistance?
I'm still an Evening Sun subscriber and I don't believe I understand the comparison to the National Enquirer. Perhaps because I don't read the National Enquirer and am not sure what it publishes.
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 12, 2014 16:27:17 GMT -5
Congratulations, moose, you are the "new" formertownie in the new BV forum. Happy for you. Have the Commissioners indicated how they will educate veterans and their families to the fact that Veterans Affairs no longer exists and they must call Human Resources for assistance? I'm still an Evening Sun subscriber and I don't believe I understand the comparison to the National Enquirer. Perhaps because I don't read the National Enquirer and am not sure what it publishes. Veteran Affairs will still be there. For a time it appears that the Human Resources department will have to field calls and direct veterans to agencies in other counties to help to respond to their needs until they hire someone in house to be able to do it. I don't think that necessarily translates into being under served. The next time you are standing in a check out line at the grocery store take a look at some of the magazines and newspapers there. On papers like the National Enquirer you will see sensational headlines, usually related to something happening in current events. For example, when the Mandela "selfie" picture surfaced I saw a headline that said "Michelle says I want a divorce." Just crazy stuff. Even crazier if you put any stock in it. By comparing the Sun to the National Enquirer I mean that sometimes they make a "cat fight" sound like a full scale riot. I can't remember if it was the National Enquirer or one of the other rags out there but I will never forget the greatest of all headlines "Chicken Faced Baby Found in Henhouse", complete with picture "proof"
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 12, 2014 16:35:17 GMT -5
"Allegedly quoted" - you mean, hearsay. Got it. Yeah, I chose my words carefully. Bottom line is my source has yet to be disproven and I have no reason yet, to doubt their claims. On the other hand, I can prove certain officials have broken the law on multiple occasions, drew up a New Clean & Green policy that was supposed to make things right but in reality was an attempt to tweak the law to make their actions lawful (note they have no authority to alter statutory nor common law), and all of their misdeeds have shifted tax burden from one group of folks to another. So, until my source(s) has been discredited or someone proves my allegations false, I shall continue preaching from my soapbox. Unless you're from the the minority that benefits from the county's C&G practices, you should welcome my viewpoint and persistence. If you're on the other side of the tracks, I seek to make you pay your lawful share of the tax burden. moose, I hope that you take this comment in the spirit it is offered. To be honest, I think it's a stretch to think that everything that happens at the Adams County Courthouse is a conspiracy. That being said, I do think you are on to something with the Clean and Green practices and I appreciate that you are like a dog with a bone trying to uncover the truth, I do. My point is, I feel that when you point the finger in too many directions it helps to discredit you from what may be real issues. And as a lifelong resident of Adams County I can tell you that there is more than a handful of people out there who's sole joy in life is stirring the pot. Don't get caught up in that! In this case, I think you should focus on the battle (the C&G) before you try to win the war. Peace.
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