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Post by Fire Marshal Bill on Oct 14, 2013 5:46:28 GMT -5
Good point about training Venter. Most local departments require members to take a basic course before they are allowed to even ride the apparatus. This course will vary from the full program of 160 hours, that will allow them to actually go inside and do an interior attack. If the individual only wants to do exterior work and not go inside they can do that in 102 hours.
In addition there is about 12 hours of training that must be completed every year to be allowed to ride.
Each step up, such as becoming a driver, hazardous materials technician, confined space technician, or any level of officer all require additional training.
The EMT course to ride the ambulance is 120 hours.
The EMT program requires 24 hours of continuing education every three years.
Most departments have company training to keep the members informed to the newest equipment the department may have, to discuss and practice the latest techniques, to try to come up with solutions to situations that may be unique to that department, or just to practice skills they don’t get to do often.
Then as has been brought up most currently have many fundraisers. Some of the local departments have something going on all the time, from various raffles, to dinners, and renting the social room for weddings, company dinners, or other uses.
This eats greatly into the individuals time.
And remember also, these individuals pay to join the department as well as paying an annual dues for the privilege of serving their neighbors and the community.
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Post by Venter on Oct 14, 2013 9:15:25 GMT -5
Times LTE this morning. Writer is a Member of an Adams Co. Fire Company for over 40 years... He thinks a Fire Tax would do more harm than good...
I don't know about you, but if I knew that most of my "Volunteer Time" was going to be tied up with Fundraising, instead of Emergency Services (or at least preparing for the possibilities of Responding to an Emergency) - I'd say, "No thanks!"
What other job is there, where you HOPE you really never need to do what you've trained so hard for?
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Post by lifesaver on Oct 14, 2013 11:25:43 GMT -5
Times LTE this morning. Writer is a Member of an Adams Co. Fire Company for over 40 years... He thinks a Fire Tax would do more harm than good...
I don't know about you, but if I knew that most of my "Volunteer Time" was going to be tied up with Fundraising, instead of Emergency Services (or at least preparing for the possibilities of Responding to an Emergency) - I'd say, "No thanks!" What other job is there, where you HOPE you really never need to do what you've trained so hard for?
I would tend to agree. However the fire tax would, in my opinion, relieve the number of fundraisers the fire departments have to do to stay afloat. I would also say that various area fundraisers are community traditions. The fire company carnivals, dinners, etc. even though attendance overall is down are still profitable. I agree that the fire tax may not attract volunteers to the department. Our fire departments will have to think out of the box to accomplish that.
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Post by lifesaver on Oct 14, 2013 11:56:17 GMT -5
Good point about training Venter. Most local departments require members to take a basic course before they are allowed to even ride the apparatus. This course will vary from the full program of 160 hours, that will allow them to actually go inside and do an interior attack. If the individual only wants to do exterior work and not go inside they can do that in 102 hours. In addition there is about 12 hours of training that must be completed every year to be allowed to ride. Each step up, such as becoming a driver, hazardous materials technician, confined space technician, or any level of officer all require additional training. The EMT course to ride the ambulance is 120 hours. The EMT program requires 24 hours of continuing education every three years. Most departments have company training to keep the members informed to the newest equipment the department may have, to discuss and practice the latest techniques, to try to come up with solutions to situations that may be unique to that department, or just to practice skills they don’t get to do often. Then as has been brought up most currently have many fundraisers. Some of the local departments have something going on all the time, from various raffles, to dinners, and renting the social room for weddings, company dinners, or other uses. This eats greatly into the individuals time. And remember also, these individuals pay to join the department as well as paying an annual dues for the privilege of serving their neighbors and the community. Do any of you long time locals remember the phosphorus haz-mat incident in the 80's? It happened at the intersection of Buford Ave. and Chambersburg St. There was also a local fire chief who lost his life in a chemical gas incident at a local fruit processing plant (can't remember how long ago 20-30 years maybe?). Because of changes and advances in haz mat training for our volunteers these incidents would have been handled differently today and lives most likely would have been saved. To give you an idea of what our volunteers could be faced with and how to handle a haz mat incident without charging in willy nilly before you know what you are dealing with take a few minutes to watch this video of a haz mat incident in Texarcana, Arkansas. It is taken from the camera of a police car. At 2:20 he notices a chemical smell and starts to back up At 3:13 fire department is staging (meaning they are standing by AWAY from the site) awaiting further information At 5:38 the dispatcher is identifying some of the chemicals in the cars at 6:37 you hear a loud explosion At 7:01 if you look above and around the street signs straight ahead you will begin to see a chemical cloud. At 7:15 All hell breaks loose and that policeman is hauling ass out of there. One person was killed in this incident. Without proper training there could have been many more. This is really something to see. www.youtube.com/watch?v=pw_bnS-qcds
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Post by Fire Marshal Bill on Oct 14, 2013 14:27:59 GMT -5
Good point about training Venter. Most local departments require members to take a basic course before they are allowed to even ride the apparatus. This course will vary from the full program of 160 hours, that will allow them to actually go inside and do an interior attack. If the individual only wants to do exterior work and not go inside they can do that in 102 hours. In addition there is about 12 hours of training that must be completed every year to be allowed to ride. Each step up, such as becoming a driver, hazardous materials technician, confined space technician, or any level of officer all require additional training. The EMT course to ride the ambulance is 120 hours. The EMT program requires 24 hours of continuing education every three years. Most departments have company training to keep the members informed to the newest equipment the department may have, to discuss and practice the latest techniques, to try to come up with solutions to situations that may be unique to that department, or just to practice skills they don’t get to do often. Then as has been brought up most currently have many fundraisers. Some of the local departments have something going on all the time, from various raffles, to dinners, and renting the social room for weddings, company dinners, or other uses. This eats greatly into the individuals time. And remember also, these individuals pay to join the department as well as paying an annual dues for the privilege of serving their neighbors and the community. Do any of you long time locals remember the phosphorus haz-mat incident in the 80's? It happened at the intersection of Buford Ave. and Chambersburg St. There was also a local fire chief who lost his life in a chemical gas incident at a local fruit processing plant (can't remember how long ago 20-30 years maybe?). Because of changes and advances in haz mat training for our volunteers these incidents would have been handled differently today and lives most likely would have been saved. To give you an idea of what our volunteers could be faced with and how to handle a haz mat incident without charging in willy nilly before you know what you are dealing with take a few minutes to watch this video of a haz mat incident in Texarcana, Arkansas. It is taken from the camera of a police car. At 2:20 he notices a chemical smell and starts to back up At 3:13 fire department is staging (meaning they are standing by AWAY from the site) awaiting further information At 5:38 the dispatcher is identifying some of the chemicals in the cars at 6:37 you hear a loud explosion At 7:01 if you look above and around the street signs straight ahead you will begin to see a chemical cloud. At 7:15 All hell breaks loose and that policeman is hauling ass out of there. One person was killed in this incident. Without proper training there could have been many more. This is really something to see. www.youtube.com/watch?v=pw_bnS-qcdsRemember that incident well. It was a long time before any fire departments were doing HazMat training, but that incident made it into many of the books and training manuals.
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Post by Fire Marshal Bill on Oct 14, 2013 14:50:09 GMT -5
Mr. Herman has some good points.
Although I don’t think the fire tax is a bad thing, and I feel very sure departments will still need to do fundraising activities. I don’t believe this tax will cover all of the department expenditures.
But he also has a good point about the recruitment and retention program.
Society has changed. When I was growing up, my dad worked and mom stayed home to take care of the kids. Dad helped at the fire station, running calls and helping with fundraisers. But back then we ran maybe 60 or 70 calls a year, and there was not a lot of fundraising required because the fire station was in a municipal building and there wasn’t a lot of training required.
When I was dating my wife, and till we had children, we both helped with the fundraisers, and I ran the emergency calls.
We worked a dinner at the fire station, one evening, and my oldest was born at noon the next day.
Then I still ran emergency calls, while she stayed with the baby, and when it came to fund raisers one of us would be there, depending on what kind of help was needed.
Now the training requirements are pretty high, and more fundraisers, because fire department cost just like everyone else is going up.
How many families do you know that don’t have both husband and wife working? Sometimes they work opposite shifts so they don’t have to get babysitting for the children, so nobody is available to help at the fire station.
One thing Maryland has done to help with Volunteer Recruitment and Retention is to establish a volunteer retirement program. If you maintain a certain number of points each year for 20 years, when you reach a specific age (usually 60 to 65) you begin to draw the retirement. The longer over 20 years you stay active, the more you collect. Now it isn’t a great amount and you couldn’t live on it, but a friend of mine is drawing $300 a month with over 30 years of service.
As for the donations, in many cases if someone was donating $20 a year 20 years ago, they are still making that same $20 donation. And with the current economy and prices going up, many have dropped that $20 donation to $15, or maybe $10.
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moose
Post Master
Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Oct 14, 2013 19:45:47 GMT -5
In Maryland, the County is responsible for providing emergency services, not the municipalities as it is in Pa. As FMB describes above, there is a retirement system in place for volunteers, called LOSAP (Length Of Service Award Program). You earn points through various ways (holding office, helping with fundraisers, serving on Committees, attending drills, and of course responding to emergency calls). I'm not going to say this is the answer, because it's just not that simple, but every little bit helps. The County pays a lot of operating expenses and each department submits a budget each year. They don't always get what they budget, but they prioritize needs. My experience is that even with a so-called fire tax (really an EMS tax), it doesn't bring in near enough to offset expenses. I doubt any department has lightened up on fundraising because of the recently created fire tax. They are still very dedicated to offering the finest fire protection they can provide. Each department still has the major purchases such as apparatus. As mentioned before, in addition to the fire-tax, donations, solicitation and fundraising, the county government has enabled certain local businesses to legally sell small games of chance of which the profit is split something like 75/25% (larger portion going to a charity such designated, usually one in the business of providing emergency services). This allows local pubs the chance to compete with the local clubs (Amvets, Legion, VFW etc) by providing some of the same services. This is a BIG shot in the arm for fire and ambulance companies. I don't know why we can't do something similar in Pa.
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Post by Alex Oreilly on Oct 14, 2013 22:09:16 GMT -5
If we had a casino, they could make a nice donation to every fire department and ambulance and medic unit in the county.
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