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Post by Fire Marshal Bill on Mar 12, 2014 16:41:06 GMT -5
Having a trained and certified agent is only one step. The individual in the job must have the passion to want to help the veterans, and continue to probe for the veterans benefit until all avenues are exhausted. And then think of some other avenues.
Back in the 50s my father (a WW II vet) had some problems and needed VA assistance with a service related health issue. The County VA director at that time told him that it was too long ago, and they couldn’t do anything. Going to one of the service officers with one of the local Veterans organizations, he was able to get the help he needed.
When I was discharged, my dad knew of some medical problems I had and encouraged me to apply for a disability. We all know how fathers can pester you about things like that, so I finally gave in and applied. When the County VA director was informed that there was nothing in my records, he told me there was nothing he can do.
With the assistance of the Disabled American Veterans (and after a three year battle) I was able to get my problems documented so that should I ever have problems things should move smoothly.
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HoneyBadger
Poster Child
HoneyBadger don't give a shit.
Posts: 373
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Post by HoneyBadger on Mar 12, 2014 18:42:40 GMT -5
[/quote]Veteran Affairs will still be there. For a time it appears that the Human Resources department will have to field calls and direct veterans to agencies in other counties to help to respond to their needs until they hire someone in house to be able to do it. I don't think that necessarily translates into being under served. The next time you are standing in a check out line at the grocery store take a look at some of the magazines and newspapers there. On papers like the National Enquirer you will see sensational headlines, usually related to something happening in current events. For example, when the Mandela "selfie" picture surfaced I saw a headline that said "Michelle says I want a divorce." Just crazy stuff. Even crazier if you put any stock in it. By comparing the Sun to the National Enquirer I mean that sometimes they make a "cat fight" sound like a full scale riot.  I can't remember if it was the National Enquirer or one of the other rags out there but I will never forget the greatest of all headlines "Chicken Faced Baby Found in Henhouse", complete with picture "proof"   [/quote] Thanks LS. I remember now, those things once were a cheap newsprint kind of rag and now they've become more like magazines. I've seen older (even older than me) ladies snatch them up. I'm usually checking my cart to see if I bought what I wrote on my list. I have to be honest about the Evening Sun - I'm still subscribed only because the York Daily Record began skipping my delivery and I cancelled them. I read the comics...sue me.  I'm simply not interested enough in world news, political news, etc to pick up the Washington Post or the New York Times, etc. Too much to wade through to reach the comics.  By the way, I missed the "Chicken Faced Baby Found in Henhouse." What a relief!!! |
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moose
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Post by moose on Mar 12, 2014 20:13:57 GMT -5
Congratulations, moose, you are the "new" formertownie in the new BV forum. Happy for you. I've been called a lot of things, and that ain't one of them. I have no clue what that is. But if you're happy for me, I'm too dumb to know what for...I guess I'll be happy too. moose, I hope that you take this comment in the spirit it is offered. To be honest, I think it's a stretch to think that everything that happens at the Adams County Courthouse is a conspiracy. That being said, I do think you are on to something with the Clean and Green practices and I appreciate that you are like a dog with a bone trying to uncover the truth, I do. My point is, I feel that when you point the finger in too many directions it helps to discredit you from what may be real issues. And as a lifelong resident of Adams County I can tell you that there is more than a handful of people out there who's sole joy in life is stirring the pot. Don't get caught up in that! In this case, I think you should focus on the battle (the C&G) before you try to win the war. Peace. I don't think EVERYTHING in the courthouse is a conspiracy. I do know what I know and if you knew the extent of what I've investigated, it really is something. The extent that they go to give breaks to those with acreage is unparalleled. It can't be an accident, as the New Clean & Green Policy serves as testimony to that. And, this has been going on long before the current commissioners got there. They just don't understand the extent of it, or are indifferent to it. I suspect that they are following the advice of their legal adviser, and we should know by now where he stands on preservationist efforts. He doesn't control the Assessment Office, so he would need help there. Guess who fits the bill there. Beyond the creative assessment techniques, the rest I'll let up to you all to consider: 1. The silencing of the public in their meetings; how are we to get any answers? They campaigned on transparency! 2. Purchase of the St. Francis building; we purchased this to plan for our future expansion needs. It would be a shame if it doesn't become the site of the new $8 mil building/court/children's & youth services etc? Buy the building(s) for expansion, then don't use it for that purpose sounds kinda goofy to me, particularly considering the proximity to other county buildings and parking. I could go on, but there's no real need to here, besides I had a rough day. It's safe to say (and, Venter can vouch for this) that they try to wear you down, hoping you'll quit. Going against town hall ain't easy when they get paid to avoid your requests. They have assets that the normal person can't match, and it surely gets frustrating. I hinted in an earlier post, and I guess everybody either missed it, or didn't think it was relevant...but I'm up against more than just the county. The presiding judge is a first cousin to one of the defendants. I won't divulge either's name at this time, but I can prove it. What are the odds that I get an unbiased decision in this matter? It's tough to accept that fact and remain positive. I plan on forging ahead nonetheless. I have a strategy planned, and if it fails, I'll have to break down and find an attorney to get things on track. Lifesaver, I appreciate your candor and delicate efforts to corral my unbridled ways. I'll take your advice into consideration to become a kinder and gentler person  |
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Post by Venter on Mar 12, 2014 21:44:21 GMT -5
Congratulations, moose, you are the "new" formertownie in the new BV forum. Happy for you. I've been called a lot of things, and that ain't one of them. I have no clue what that is. But if you're happy for me, I'm too dumb to know what for...I guess I'll be happy too. moose, I hope that you take this comment in the spirit it is offered. To be honest, I think it's a stretch to think that everything that happens at the Adams County Courthouse is a conspiracy. That being said, I do think you are on to something with the Clean and Green practices and I appreciate that you are like a dog with a bone trying to uncover the truth, I do. My point is, I feel that when you point the finger in too many directions it helps to discredit you from what may be real issues. And as a lifelong resident of Adams County I can tell you that there is more than a handful of people out there who's sole joy in life is stirring the pot. Don't get caught up in that! In this case, I think you should focus on the battle (the C&G) before you try to win the war. Peace. I don't think EVERYTHING in the courthouse is a conspiracy. I do know what I know and if you knew the extent of what I've investigated, it really is something. The extent that they go to give breaks to those with acreage is unparalleled. It can't be an accident, as the New Clean & Green Policy serves as testimony to that. And, this has been going on long before the current commissioners got there. They just don't understand the extent of it, or are indifferent to it. I suspect that they are following the advice of their legal adviser, and we should know by now where he stands on preservationist efforts. He doesn't control the Assessment Office, so he would need help there. Guess who fits the bill there. Beyond the creative assessment techniques, the rest I'll let up to you all to consider: 1. The silencing of the public in their meetings; how are we to get any answers? They campaigned on transparency! 2. Purchase of the St. Francis building; we purchased this to plan for our future expansion needs. It would be a shame if it doesn't become the site of the new $8 mil building/court/children's & youth services etc? Buy the building(s) for expansion, then don't use it for that purpose sounds kinda goofy to me, particularly considering the proximity to other county buildings and parking. I could go on, but there's no real need to here, besides I had a rough day. It's safe to say (and, Venter can vouch for this) that they try to wear you down, hoping you'll quit. Going against town hall ain't easy when they get paid to avoid your requests. They have assets that the normal person can't match, and it surely gets frustrating. I hinted in an earlier post, and I guess everybody either missed it, or didn't think it was relevant...but I'm up against more than just the county. The presiding judge is a first cousin to one of the defendants. I won't divulge either's name at this time, but I can prove it. What are the odds that I get an unbiased decision in this matter? It's tough to accept that fact and remain positive. I plan on forging ahead nonetheless. I have a strategy planned, and if it fails, I'll have to break down and find an attorney to get things on track. Lifesaver, I appreciate your candor and delicate efforts to corral my unbridled ways. I'll take your advice into consideration to become a kinder and gentler person Moose, 1) FormerTownie is the name that HoneyBadger had in her other life on Boroughvent. She was often the Person on the Forum with one particular view or another - and it seems like she was usually on the Other Side, even when she wasn't!
And it looks like you're being ganged-up on a bit.
B) I definitely understand the feeling that you have when they try to beat you down. Even when they know you are right, and they are wrong, they will NOT accept it until the Courts are actually involved. For some reason, their pride is more important than OUR TAX MONEY! Tens of Thousands of Dollars is nothing to them - Hell, it's not THEIR money they're spending to defend stupid shit! And... What could YOU Know - you're not an Elected Official. And my favorite was the one I was asked... "What Law School Did YOU Go To?"
I guess we can't understand the Law if we never went to Law School - then how can they expect ANYONE to ABIDE by Laws!? III) "The presiding judge is a first cousin to one of the defendants."
Well, if they didn't marry outside of the Region anywhere in the Early 1900s, then that could be almost ANYONE from Gettysburg. I think there should be DNA Testing before marriage. K) "Lifesaver, I appreciate your candor and delicate efforts to corral my unbridled ways."
I understand your response, but I also understand the way Lifesaver meant her comment. NOBODY is asking you to Stand Down, or STOP Doing What You are Doing. Your Concentration has been on the C&G, and that is where you seem to have rallied support. As you begin to get pulled into other "Issues", your "Supporters" may NOT be willing to follow you "there". They may be 100% behind the C&G and Equal Taxation - But not so keen to follow you into the Abyss of the Court System. If you begin to stretch yourself TOO THIN, then you could alienate the base that you have already mustered (or Mustard) As you continue to rub up against the underbelly, you get scraped by a shitload of barnacles. They WANT to RUB you RAW, and they do a fantastic job of it. Silence is There BEST Defense, Because They KNOW It will Force YOU to take the Offense, or become "Offensive". You'll be pushed to the Boiling Point, and then Erupt, and it will probably be at a Public Meeting - Then YOU'LL have Fallen into their Trap. THEIR SILENCE IS THEIR TACTIC, IN EFFECT, TAUNTING YOU INTO MISBEHAVING - DON'T BITE!  You are the "Person with Information, and the Knowledge, and the BALLS to Use It". People are MORE than willing to Share their Dirt with you, because "maybe YOU can do something about it... " BUT, They will NOT be Willing to Support YOU when the time comes, if you need their help. Even if they have PROOF, they may share it with you, but they won't take a stand - or take THE Stand if necessary. You are on your own, but you are certainly NOT ALONE. I think a few of us need to get together soon. |
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davew
Poster Child
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Post by davew on Mar 13, 2014 9:44:48 GMT -5
Thanks LS. I remember now, those things once were a cheap newsprint kind of rag and now they've become more like magazines. I've seen older (even older than me) ladies snatch them up. I'm usually checking my cart to see if I bought what I wrote on my list. Thats who always buys them, old ladies. My grandmother got the times, and a whole slew of tabloids. That was her reading material. used to drive my mother nuts that she'd spend money on the tabloids, as she was an otherwise reasonable person who needed two things: * a soap opera show once a day * tabloids to read on a regular basis She never talked like the tabloids are written, I have no idea what she wanted but they satisfied something! When I was working at a winter job in college (sealed air) making recycled material mailers, there was always a lot of tabloids in the papers, and people would pull them out and put them in stacks next to the operators stations in jobs where there was several minutes of work, and then a couple of minutes of waiting for the machines. You could either shoot the breeze or read tabloids, but if you were at a station that wasn't close to anyone else, stacks of tabloids was all that was there. Then the decision was stare at the wall or read tabloids - neither was was any better than the other! |
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 13, 2014 10:37:53 GMT -5
Thanks Venter. It's true that if you've lived here all your life and you go back far enough you probably have some kind of distant relation to almost anybody in Adams County. I'm happy to say that I have done my part to help dilute that gene pool by marrying someone who isn't even remotely connected to anyone in the area, other than his own family. Also very true that you will find tongue waggers all over the county who like to talk (never mind that some of them can't back up their claims) but when backed into a corner they don't want to get involved. These are also the people who never bother to really learn about the people they vote for (if they bother to vote at all). Yet, let something like the tax reassessment come around and they're all up in arms. They're not willing to help to do anything about it, mind you, but by God that just ain't right. But there are a few of us around who aren't afraid to speak up when something isn't right. I've even been known to change my mind on occasion, once I learn the facts. It's called keeping an open mind. Moose, you may have more help out there than you think.  |
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 13, 2014 10:45:30 GMT -5
Having a trained and certified agent is only one step. The individual in the job must have the passion to want to help the veterans, and continue to probe for the veterans benefit until all avenues are exhausted. And then think of some other avenues. Bingo FMB! I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm finding more and more that there are a lot of people out there who are in their job but aren't really interested in doing their job. There is a huge difference in just doing enough to get by and really throwing your heart and soul into your work, especially when that work is in service to others. |
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Post by Fire Marshal Bill on Mar 22, 2014 10:49:30 GMT -5
The more I think about this the more I think something is up and we are not getting the whole story. I find it very hard to believe that two people would quit their jobs over just reassigning the office from an independent department to working within another department. I am sure there is more to this story than we have heard.
I have just heard one of the commissioners made the statement "if Mr. Farrel were so concerned about and dedicated to Veterans matters he would not have quit his position."
Hopefully we can get the whole story sometime.
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Post by Venter on Mar 22, 2014 12:04:07 GMT -5
The more I think about this the more I think something is up and we are not getting the whole story. I find it very hard to believe that two people would quit their jobs over just reassigning the office from an independent department to working within another department. I am sure there is more to this story than we have heard. I have just heard one of the commissioners made the statement "if Mr. Farrel were so concerned about and dedicated to Veterans matters he would not have quit his position." Hopefully we can get the whole story sometime. Big Article in the Gettysburg Times about this, this morning. |
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moose
Post Master
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Post by moose on Mar 22, 2014 19:33:45 GMT -5
The Gettysburg Times article was much better this time around. At least they got some input from both sides. Not sure what to think of all this. I wasn't copied on Mr. Farrell's 7 page letter that was referenced. It's clear that something surely upset the only two Veterans' Affairs employees who could actually do something for the veterans. I'm guessing it will take some time to get back to status quo again, depending on whom they eventually hire. I do think that the two former employees were passionate about their jobs. If those two remained, it sounds like they would have had a full-time assistant, which they didn't really need. Ms. DeGroft was reportedly working part-time (two days/week) in Purchasing (I think). I don't see how it would have been that hard to pull her out of there...?? I'll let things calm down a bit, then maybe I'll go in and see how they can service me. I've been holding off for years inquiring about anything that might be available to me. Click here for the Gettysburg Times article. |
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Post by lifesaver on Mar 23, 2014 8:15:46 GMT -5
The Gettysburg Times article was much better this time around. At least they got some input from both sides. Not sure what to think of all this. I wasn't copied on Mr. Farrell's 7 page letter that was referenced. It's clear that something surely upset the only two Veterans' Affairs employees who could actually do something for the veterans. I'm guessing it will take some time to get back to status quo again, depending on whom they eventually hire. I do think that the two former employees were passionate about their jobs. If those two remained, it sounds like they would have had a full-time assistant, which they didn't really need. Ms. DeGroft was reportedly working part-time (two days/week) in Purchasing (I think). I don't see how it would have been that hard to pull her out of there...?? I'll let things calm down a bit, then maybe I'll go in and see how they can service me. I've been holding off for years inquiring about anything that might be available to me. Click here for the Gettysburg Times article. So, Mr. Farrell claims he cares deeply about the veterans, doesn't like the way they are treated, so his solution is to jump ship and leave them in the lurch until a replacement can be hired and trained. Yeah, that'll show em. Sorry, not buying it. In the case of Ms. DeGroft, who by all indications in the articles COULD HAVE stepped in to the director's job for a seamless transition with no lapse in service yet she tenders her resignation effective the same day? I don't know about you, but I wouldn't leave a job voluntarily these days unless I had something else to go to. Agree moose, things just aren't adding up. |
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moose
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Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Apr 23, 2014 13:39:57 GMT -5
It has unofficially been reported that Commissioner Phiel's Campaign Manager and Best Friend Forever, Stan Clark, has been named to the vacant Veteran's Administration Officer/Director.
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Post by redlock on Apr 24, 2014 12:53:43 GMT -5
It has unofficially been reported that Commissioner Phiel's Campaign Manager and Best Friend Forever, Stan Clark, has been named to the vacant Veteran's Administration Officer/Director. The above snipped from the Times. Hhmmmm, aren't there 3 commissioners? There seems to be a number missing from the vote tally. |
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moose
Post Master
Posts: 184
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Post by moose on Apr 24, 2014 15:05:12 GMT -5
It has unofficially been reported that Commissioner Phiel's Campaign Manager and Best Friend Forever, Stan Clark, has been named to the vacant Veteran's Administration Officer/Director. The above snipped from the Times. Hhmmmm, aren't there 3 commissioners? There seems to be a number missing from the vote tally. I don't have any first-hand knowledge, but I'd suspect that Phiel could have recused himself so it wouldn't look so staged. |
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Post by lifesaver on Apr 24, 2014 16:04:34 GMT -5
Redlock and moose, here is the article in it's entirety so you won't have to, what's the buzzword......."speculate" |
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Post by Spin Doctor on Apr 24, 2014 22:26:22 GMT -5
No-brainer here. Mr Clark was clearly the best choice for the position.
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moose
Post Master
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Post by moose on Apr 25, 2014 4:40:24 GMT -5
No-brainer here. Mr Clark was clearly the best choice for the position. Spindoctor, since you're so close to the situation, please do tell us who the other candidates were, so we may also judge whether Mr. Clark was the best candidate. I had a gentleman email me and told me he applied for the position and never heard a thing back from them. He went on to thank me and quote "Keep up the good work and exposing these clowns for what they are! A bunch of cronies in bed with each other!" Personally, I don't know whether Mr. Clark is the best candidate or not. His background, if true (and as presented in the paper), sounds like it positions him well for the position, but keep in mind I predicted this course of action well BEFORE it happened, and BEFORE I knew a peep of Mr. Clark's alleged qualifications. |
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Post by Spin Doctor on Apr 25, 2014 6:51:39 GMT -5
Moose, apparently, you cannot read. I never said I was close to the situation.
Since you are too cheap to spend 75 cents and buy the paper, you are often times misinformed. Ask any veteran in the county (there are more than 9,000), they will tell you that Mr Clark is hands down the best person for the job.
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Post by Javier Miguel Vazquez III on Apr 25, 2014 7:45:32 GMT -5
No-brainer here. Mr Clark was clearly the best choice for the position. Agree, this is fact, not an opinion. |
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moose
Post Master
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Post by moose on Apr 25, 2014 8:27:36 GMT -5
Moose, apparently, you cannot read. I never said I was close to the situation. Since you are too cheap to spend 75 cents and buy the paper, you are often times misinformed. Ask any veteran in the county (there are more than 9,000), they will tell you that Mr Clark is hands down the best person for the job. Well, you MUST be close to the situation IF you proclaim Mr. Clark to be the best candidate of the bunch. So, you MUST know the remainder of the candidates, or you just tend to make vague unsubstantiated statements. I often do get the paper, and sometimes after reading it, I am just as uninformed as the rest of the readers who read it. I AM a veteran in the County, and I do NOT know for a fact that Mr. Clark IS the best candidate. Perhaps he is, perhaps not. So, those of you who proclaim him to be the best, it is your opinion, not fact. Nothing against Mr. Clark, as I don't know him, but I did know enough to KNOW that he'd get the job BEFORE I EVEN KNEW HE HAD APPLIED FOR IT. So, it would appear as if I'm a little more informed than you realize. |
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Post by paulkellett on Apr 25, 2014 15:23:32 GMT -5
I am with old Moosey on this one. Yes, probably Mr. Clark was the best candidate, but stating it as a fact? What if the other candidates were Gordon H. Mansfield and Hershel Wayne Gober? As you know,( and I certainly didn't) they were the Sec. of Vet. Aff. under G.W. Bush and Clinton respectively. My point is that we do not know who the other candidates were. What we do know is that the old staff resigned after becoming disenchanted with the commissioners and that a vacancy appeared that just happened to be Chairman Phiel's best friend's dream job ( his words) Mr. Clark has done a huge amount for veterans and I do not wish to in any way say that he was not the best, but at the same time I understand Moose's concerns and share them.
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Post by redlock on Apr 25, 2014 16:47:51 GMT -5
Moose, apparently, you cannot read. I never said I was close to the situation. Since you are too cheap to spend 75 cents and buy the paper, you are often times misinformed. Ask any veteran in the county (there are more than 9,000), they will tell you that Mr Clark is hands down the best person for the job. Well, you MUST be close to the situation IF you proclaim Mr. Clark to be the best candidate of the bunch. So, you MUST know the remainder of the candidates, or you just tend to make vague unsubstantiated statements. I often do get the paper, and sometimes after reading it, I am just as uninformed as the rest of the readers who read it. I AM a veteran in the County, and I do NOT know for a fact that Mr. Clark IS the best candidate. Perhaps he is, perhaps not. So, those of you who proclaim him to be the best, it is your opinion, not fact. Nothing against Mr. Clark, as I don't know him, but I did know enough to KNOW that he'd get the job BEFORE I EVEN KNEW HE HAD APPLIED FOR IT. So, it would appear as if I'm a little more informed than you realize. I AM NOT a veteran and I'm aware of Mr. Clarks background and dedication as I've seen or heard of his involvement in many military/veteran oriented events. Top of my head I know he is involved with Sgt Mac. Memorial Foundation. (I also think he was involved with the Sgt. Mac Scholarship award presented to a Senior at GAHS) Gettysburg American Legion Gettysburg VFW Gettysburg Marine Corp League The 40 & 8 (99.9% of the U.S. population hasn't heard of or know of this organization) And.....The Wounded Warriors Mr. Clark is definitely involved with local veterans and from what I've seen genuinely cares about all of them. |
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Post by lifesaver on Apr 25, 2014 18:58:43 GMT -5
No-brainer here. Mr Clark was clearly the best choice for the position. Spindoctor, since you're so close to the situation, please do tell us who the other candidates were, so we may also judge whether Mr. Clark was the best candidate. I had a gentleman email me and told me he applied for the position and never heard a thing back from them. He went on to thank me and quote "Keep up the good work and exposing these clowns for what they are! A bunch of cronies in bed with each other!" Personally, I don't know whether Mr. Clark is the best candidate or not. His background, if true (and as presented in the paper), sounds like it positions him well for the position, but keep in mind I predicted this course of action well BEFORE it happened, and BEFORE I knew a peep of Mr. Clark's alleged qualifications. Maybe you should have asked to be one of the four local veterans who sat in on the interview process, then you would have had first hand knowledge of who the other candidates were and their qualifications. And you think it's a conspiracy because someone applied and wasn't called for an interview? Seriously? You've never heard of screening applicants? Personally, I think it's a little far fetched to think that everything that happens in the commissioner's office is a conspiracy. From the details reported in the article it seems to me that the interview and hiring process was fair and completely above board. And it was appropriate that Mr. Phiel recused himself from the entire process. And, as spellchecker so eloquently informed me earlier, your observation was merely speculation and projection. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then.  |
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Post by Alex Oreilly on Apr 25, 2014 20:01:41 GMT -5
So before they put the department under the human resources, how many veterans actually used their services or even knew Adams County had a Veterans Office?
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Post by Fire Marshal Bill on Apr 26, 2014 7:19:21 GMT -5
I don’t think anyone ever applies for a job, especially a position such as this, without believing that they are the best qualified for the position. After all, why waste my time filling out an application, or resume if I don’t stand a chance.
I’m sure most if not all the applicants were well qualified for the position but one person is the best qualified. At least on paper and in the interviews.
Some people may be great for the job, but just can’t put it down on paper, or interview poorly. On the other hand there are those who can make themselves look good on paper, and do well on the interview, but may not do well in the job.
Although I don’t know Mr. Clark personally, I have seen him involved with veterans activities. I have seen him demonstrate a passion for the organizations he supports, and feel he will carry this into his new position, but we will only know once he is in the job.
I wish Mr. Clark every success in this position, and hope I will never need his services. I also hope the time will come when there is no longer a need for this position.
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I'm simply not interested enough in world news, political news, etc to pick up the Washington Post or the New York Times, etc. Too much to wade through to reach the comics. 
